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Dare To Inquire: The 'Liberal ' Betrayal of Jews |
Category: Articles 28 comments 14 Nov 2003 @ 11:30 by mewebber @209.179.53.152 : Supporting war against Arab terrorThe complicit tolerance liberals exhibit towards terrorism, the failure of large segments of the left to condemn the crimes of Al Quaida and the Palestinians despite their well publicized and long-running crimes against humanity is revolting. Christians, worthy of that name, should show undivided support to our President and Israel in their fight for freedom, because of our own concerns, our own belief in the Bible and our love for our Jewish brothers and sisters. Yasser Arafat and the Palestinian Authority are terrorists and the rest of the world should let Israel fight its enemies as the U.S. is fighting its own. Israel cannot negotiate with terrorism. Terrorism cannot be rewarded with statehood. Now or in the future, a Palestinian state would sound the death knell of Israel. 14 Nov 2003 @ 12:54 by Bruce Kodish @24.205.69.22 : Supporting war against Arab terror Thanks for your support. 14 Nov 2003 @ 13:29 by vibrani : Liberals I'm a liberal and I strongly support the war against Arab terror. I know many other liberals who feel the same way...just fyi. 14 Nov 2003 @ 16:53 by mewebber @209.179.230.19 : Liberals:"well meaning" but blind & dumb Every year huge numbers of Arabs/Muslims from Saudi Arabia, Pakistan, Kuwaitis, Syria, Egypt, Albania and dozens of other ethnic Muslim states who hate America swarm into the United States and add to the already increasing numbers of Arab/Muslim. And every year hundreds of mosques, which preach the extermination of all non-Muslims and the Islamization of America, are being added to the thousands already pointing their minarets skyward. The vast majority (80%) of American mosques are funded with Saudi Arabian money and most subscribe to 18th century Wahhabism that calls for the spread of Islam through violence. Many mosques, "Islamic Learning Centers" and Arab/Muslim Student Unions are distributing large numbers of pamphlets and leaflets attacking Judaism, Christianity and other non-Muslim religions and urging young Americans (esp. angry black Americans) to convert to Islam! Not surprisingly, a large number of African-Americans convert to Islam while in the prison systems! The National Islamic Prison Foundation, which coordinates a campaign to convert inmates to Islam claim an average of 135,000 such conversions per year. And if thousands of self-hating, Leftwing Jews hadn't already converted to Buddhism, they too might be targeted! 14 Nov 2003 @ 17:44 by Undergrace @209.179.230.19 : History is a record of progress But some people will never learn. Prevarication and denigration are the hallmarks of most liberal argument. Truth is that Reagan won the cold war and, God willing, Bush will win the war against Islamo-fascism! Reagan was right back then and as Bush is right now! As the facts are becoming more and more self-evident, many liberals (not all) have become more bitter and angry. The Soviet threat has been vaporized, American women are among the freest in the world, and the gravest danger facing most black Americans today is the risk of being patronized to death. The liberal catechism includes a hatred of Christians, guns, free market, and patriotism and an infatuation with abortion, the environment, and race discrimination (or in the favored parlance of liberals, "affirmative action"). Heresy on any of these subjects is, well, heresy. The most crazed religious fanatic argues in more calm and reasoned tones than any liberal I know on any of these issues. They complain about the detention of terror suspects, they complained we were going to lose the war, they complain about military tribunals for terrorists, they complain the war is taking too long, they complain about (nonexistent) ethnic profiling at airports, they complain about the treatment of prisoners at Guantanamo, they complain about Bush's speech and they complain about all the damn "flag-wavers". It must have been galling to them that no one in America cared. Here the country had finally given liberals a war against fundamentalism and they didn't want to fight it. They would have, except it would put them on the same side as the United States. Liberals hate America, they hate "flag-wavers," they hate abortion opponents, they hate all religions except Islam (post 9/11). Even Islamic terrorists don't hate America like liberals do. They don't have the energy. If they had that much energy, they'd have indoor plumbing by now. 15 Nov 2003 @ 04:18 by vibrani : I second that Bernie. Labeling - left-wing Jews, liberals who like Islam and hate America (what complete nonsense! Remember the Constitution? Liberals who I know will do everything to protect and defend our Constitution), the illusion that Jews who converted to Buddhism will be spared (haven't you heard it's the even the tiniest amount of Jewish blood that matters to haters?)...well, how do people like MeWebber and Undergrace serve anyone by what they're saying? By the way, there IS ethnic profiling at airports - talk to people who experience it each flight they take. Flag waving doesn't make you a good person or a good American. If your goal is to separate Americans and alienate them based on their freedom to choose a religion or political party, etc., you're succeeding and promoting things for which America wasn't founded. P.S. A report just came over the wire about two synagogues in Istanbul being bombed by terrorists. At least 16 people were killed and 165 injured - mostly women. 15 Nov 2003 @ 06:56 by waalstraat : Tell me my Friends Who refuse to name terrorism against Jews as terror: Is the bombing of Synagogues militancy or terrorism....??? European antipathy toward Jews is reinforcing extremist Islamic Terrorists'actions...do you want to criticaize terrorism wherever it occurs or by whomever is guilty of it, or do you want to be a cause of it... 15 Nov 2003 @ 10:42 by vibrani : Terrorism Yes, that is the crux of it. Now we know that at least 20 were killed and more than 260 wounded. Israel denounced the blasts in an official Foreign Ministry statement, calling them "criminal terror attacks" and saying "terror is terror whether it targets Jews or non-Jews." "This is a bomb aimed at the stability and peace in the Turkish Republic," Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan told reporters during a visit to the breakaway Turkish Cypriot republic. "I am damning this... this is an attack against the humanity." 15 Nov 2003 @ 15:25 by Bruce Kodish @24.205.69.22 : 'Liberals' Like many words 'liberal(s)' often qualifies in such discussions as over-defined (intensionally), i.e., by verbal definition and under-defined (extensionally), i.e., by means of specific non-verbal examples, criteria, context, etc., that one can point to. To me Wisse provides some useful provocation for those who have supported 'liberal' ideals re economic/political freedom, but who are beginning to see that extending the had of universal brotherhood to men/and women who want to kill you, will leave you dead. Yasser Arafat, Osama bin Laden and their cronies have provided abundant evidence they hate Jews and want to kill as many as they can. So to me, any continuing attempt to negotiate with them, seems unreasonable. The former heads of Israeli security who severely criticized the present Israeli governement all, I believe, belong to the left labor camp. Their behavior is that of fundamentalists, yes--fundamentalist liberals do exist. They, I think , would rather condemn their own government than accept the failure of their rigid belief that they can achieve a negotiated peace settlement with Arafat's government. Luftmenschen--waalstraat, my friend. They have their heads in the clouds and would seem to prefer to keep their heads there while they walk (and direct as many others as they can) straight into the pit. Having said that, I think that Undergrace undercuts her/his argument by making overgeneralized statements implyingthat all 'liberals' hate all religions except Islam, for example, cannot be correct as both waalstraat and vibrani provide living counter-examples. 16 Nov 2003 @ 00:29 by vibrani : numbers changed Over 20 people were killed in Turkey and near Paris fire gutted the Merkaz HaTorah Jewish secondary school in the Paris suburb of Gagny in the Seine-Saint-Denis region Saturday morning at 3am. There were no injuries. Fire started simultaneously in two separate places on the first floor of the school where works were under way. A primary school and a kindergarten for 200 children were to be inaugurated there in January 2004. "The criminal origin of the blaze is more than strongly suspected which gives, for this Jewish school, an anti-Semitic and obviously racist connotation," said Interior Minister Nicolas Sarkozy. Israel links to anti-Semitism in Europe, which we know is severe right now. {http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite pagename=JPost/JPArticle/ShowFull&cid=1068880713786} "This shows that there is still lots of work to do to fight against all forms of anti-Semitism," the minister added. "The world must understand that Islamic anti-Semitism and Islamic terror are the same," Sharansky said, and that "together they represent an existential threat to all of us Jews and non-Jews. As a result, a war against terrorism must include a war against anti-Semitism." 16 Nov 2003 @ 11:41 by Bruce Kodish @24.205.69.22 : Islamist Jew-Hatred Islamist Jew-Hatred/Anti-Zionism represents an existential threat to Muslims too, Would that more Muslims realize that. 16 Nov 2003 @ 16:21 by waalstraat : Hi Bruce Althoug I feel friendly to you too, I just read this cartoon that reminde me a little your positition and that of some of your commentors. Of cours undergrace and MeWebber are not included because they are living breathing programmed cartoons exclusive of the link I am sending you. Here is the Link: http://www.uclick.com/client/nyt/db/ It seems the link changes daily and I have just found that out...so it is most likely relevant to this comment. It was about Anne Wisse's book and the commentator commenting on it sounde almost word for word like my friend Bruce...sorry if I took you for an irrelivant interlude 16 Nov 2003 @ 16:23 by vibrani : Is someone NOT reading what's posted in this log about being liberals and not hating the president or America? Liberalism has become a bad name and why? It's ridiculous. Like the comic strip! 16 Nov 2003 @ 16:51 by mewebber @209.179.52.141 : The Self-hating Leftwing Extending the hand of universal brotherhood to men and women who want to kill you, will leave you dead. They (the Leftwing), I think , would rather condemn their own government than accept the failure of their rigid belief that they can achieve a negotiated peace settlement with Arafat's government. ABSOLUTELY RIGHT, you nailed that one head on! It's part of the same morbid pathology the Democrats are suffering from and the reason why we hear a supposedly learned person like Noam Chomsky call the United States one of the leading terrorist nations in the world. It's false, absurd and a very treacherous teaching. We have done more good for more people than any country in the history of the world. What would make an educated Jew grow into a frustrated, embittered and rebellious writer and a spokesman for the Arab terror? History affords us numerous examples of leftwing thinker (what an oxymoron) confused over their identities. The behavior of anti-Zionist Jews clearly reveals a rejection of themselves as Jews and an unconscious acquiescence to the image which their enemies seek to project of them. It is a most pernicious form of political defeatism. For if all oppressed peoples reacted in the same perverse way, seeking to identify themselves with their oppressor, national emancipation would be an impossibility. The anti-Zionists fail to understand that national liberation implies legitimate self-defense and the defense of Judaism. The vicissitudes of the Diaspora have brought about a state of affairs in which many marginal Jews are interested in neither the one nor the other. Some lose their sense of identity and any residual loyalty they might owe to other Jews and proclaim a shocking solidarity with those who bring death to their brethren. 17 Nov 2003 @ 10:41 by Undergrace @69.33.46.10 : Why Liberalism is getting a bad name Not ALL liberals are hatemonger and many are good people. The problem is that most of them are out of touch with the real world and gullible and this makes them easy target for unscrupulous manipulators who slander patriotic Americans as criminals, akin to Nazis, and discount great traditions based on individual rights and ideals. Unless you are in the routine habit of getting your information from a number of different sources, chances are your opinions and understandings are based on false teaching meant to keep you in the dark. How do you know that what they taught you in school is true? How do you know it is to be believed? Only through study and open mindedness can you know the entire truth and be free. Read this: While Berkeley claims to be "progressive" and "hate free", this is just a cloak for left wing racism and hate. Berkeley has implicitly given left wing hate groups a green light to attack innocent people and institutions, so long as the victims are white, conservative and/or Jewish. After a series of attacks on Jews in Berkeley, the Berkeley City Council did NOTHING. Now, months later, the Council continues to stonewall, sending a clear message to the world that left wing hate has a home in Berkeley. The Berkeley City Council has attempted to institute a boycott of Israel because Israel had the gall to defend itself against Palestinian terror attacks, even though it has been clearly shown that such a boycott would violate US laws. Rather than support Israel, the United States' only real ally in the war against terror, Berkeley is supporting the enemies of Israel and the United States. Ten reasons to boycott Berkeley: http://www.berkeleyboycott.com/tenreasons.htm Berkeley supports terrorists. When you support Berkeley's economy, you are supporting terrorism. 17 Nov 2003 @ 12:33 by vibrani : warnings Members of the Knesset Foreign Affairs and Defense Committee heard at their sitting Monday morning from Mossad chief Maj.-Gen. (res.) Meir Dagan, who warned the that there are currently forty terror attack warnings against Jewish and Israeli targets worldwide, and that Iran's nuclear program poses the greatest existential threat to Israel since the Jewish state's creation in 1948. 17 Nov 2003 @ 13:27 by Bruce Kodish @24.205.69.22 : Militant Islam or Islamism I'm glad to see some evidence of more careful qualifying by my friends undergrace and mewebber. Just a note to encourage further qualifying between different 'liberals'. Let's not assume that everyone who calls him/herself a liberal is the same as our image of liberals. Islam and Islamism also need distinguishing. Islam constitutes a religion of peace only among those who practice it in peace as their personal religion. Islamists use Islam as a political ideology to advance their totalitarian vision. Unfortunately, Islamists to a very significant extent seem to run the show in the so-called Muslim world. Arafat by the way has belonged to the Muslim Brotherhood and to call him 'secular' doesn't do his brand of tyranny justice. 17 Nov 2003 @ 17:25 by mewebber @69.33.46.10 : Careful qualifying To all our misguided liberal friends out there: Question: You're walking down a deserted street with your wife and two small children. Suddenly, a dangerous looking man with a huge knife comes around the corner and is running at you while screaming obscenities in Arabic. In your hand is a .357 Magnum. You have mere seconds before he reaches you and your family. What do you do? - Liberal Answer: Well that's not enough information to answer the question! Does the man look poor or oppressed? Do I understand Arabic? How do I know those are obscenities hes screaming? Have I ever done anything to him thats inspiring him to attack? Could we run away? What does my wife think? What about the kids? What about the UN? Could I possibly swing the gun like a club and knock the knife out of his hand? What does the law say about this situation? Is it possible he'd be happy with just killing me? Does he definitely want to kill me or would he just be content to wound me? If I were to grab his knees and hold on, could my family get away while he was stabbing me? This is all so confusing! I need to debate this with some friends for a few days to try to come to a conclusion. - Conservative Answer: I shoot the SOB!!! 17 Nov 2003 @ 17:51 by vibrani : Oh get real Liberals aren't stupid and wouldn't stand by and let themselves or their family be killed if they can do something to prevent it. Even in the Hebrew bible (which doesn't talk about being liberal or conservative) having to kill someone to protect yourself or others is the only form of murder excused. When someone comes to obviously kill you, kill them first. 17 Nov 2003 @ 18:21 by mewebber @69.33.46.10 : Good response! America is doing its part: http://www.whitehouse.gov/response/index.html 17 Nov 2003 @ 18:27 by vibrani : and {http://www.vibrani.com/Palestinians.htm} 17 Nov 2003 @ 18:36 by mewebber @69.33.46.10 : A Worldwide Threat My point exactly! And what about Muzammil Siddiqi, head of the Islamic Society of North America, only six months prior to being a so-called emissary of "Islamic peace", he expressed his support for Hamas and Hezbollah during an Islamic rally outside the White House: http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn?pagename=article&node=&contentId=A55677-2001Oct1¬Found=true His comments were so inflammatory that even Hillary Clinton was forced to return campaign donations from the group. The time is rapidly approaching when we are going to have to reach the obvious conclusion that this is as much a war against the radical Islamic ideology of the Middle East as it is against terror. What is it going to take? ISRAEL ANTI-TERROR RESPONSE WORKS. Kill them first. And fast. And without warning. 17 Nov 2003 @ 18:47 by vibrani : The gross mistake that people make is thinking the war we are in isn't about extremist Muslims, and that Islam means peace - it does not. It means submission to Islam and Allah (and jihad). 18 Nov 2003 @ 11:48 by Undergrace @69.33.46.10 : Why Christians should support Israel While some Christians try to deny the connection between Jesus of Nazareth and the Jews of the world, Jesus never denied his Jewishness. He was born Jewish, He was circumcised on the eighth day in keeping with Jewish tradition, He had his Bar Mitzvah on his 13th birthday, He kept the law of Moses, and He wore the Prayer Shawl Moses commanded all Jewish men to wear: http://www.jhm.org/support-israel.asp 18 Nov 2003 @ 11:49 by vibrani : That's correct (IF you assume Jesus really lived) all Christians are really Jews...something some Christians would rather not agree with or like to remember. 29 Jan 2015 @ 07:58 by Nazli @193.106.31.234 : orLJnZjQplPYeMF , which is fully in the spirit of one of the down sides of sides of Ayn Rand, nalemy the temptation to do history a priori. This shows up in the claim that: The Israelis are like us, the Palestinians are not, therefore the Israelis must be right and the Palestinians wrong. This is sheer nonsense and intellectually inadmissible. When one group, which claims to speak and act in behalf of The Jewish People worldwide, engages in massive land theft and other atrocities, you can hardly be surprised when some members of the victimized group blame The Jewish People itself for the crime. Assigning collective guilt is wrong, but the Zionist movement invites it by asserting that it is represents The Jewish People. (Israelis routinely assign collective guilt to the Palestinians, punishing others besides the perpetrators of crimes.)The fact is that from the start, most Jews opposed political Zionism precisely because it would necessarily violate the Palestinians' rights and because they abhorred the politicization of their religion, which they correctly predicted would corrupt the faith. (Today being a good Jew means little more than being unquestioningly loyal to Israel.)I close by again recommending Jeremy Hammmond's carefully documented . This is an accurate telling of the ugly founding of the state of Israel. Anyone who knows me or my work knows that approach issues in good faith and with care. I was once a supporter of Israel. I grew up in a home that was devoted to the state, but a dispassionate investigation of the history caused me to change my mind. The Palestinians are the victims--and one need not approve of their corrupt "leadership" to see this. I heartily recommend Hammond's work. There is much else that one can read after it, but it would make a fine start."We have come here and stolen their country. Why should they accept that?" --David Ben-Gurion, Israel's first prime minister. 29 Jan 2015 @ 18:48 by Hamada @153.120.55.138 : tcCtRmPjzRX , which is fully in the spirit of one of the down sides of sides of Ayn Rand, nelamy the temptation to do history a priori. This shows up in the claim that: The Israelis are like us, the Palestinians are not, therefore the Israelis must be right and the Palestinians wrong. This is sheer nonsense and intellectually inadmissible. When one group, which claims to speak and act in behalf of The Jewish People worldwide, engages in massive land theft and other atrocities, you can hardly be surprised when some members of the victimized group blame The Jewish People itself for the crime. Assigning collective guilt is wrong, but the Zionist movement invites it by asserting that it is represents The Jewish People. (Israelis routinely assign collective guilt to the Palestinians, punishing others besides the perpetrators of crimes.)The fact is that from the start, most Jews opposed political Zionism precisely because it would necessarily violate the Palestinians' rights and because they abhorred the politicization of their religion, which they correctly predicted would corrupt the faith. (Today being a good Jew means little more than being unquestioningly loyal to Israel.)I close by again recommending Jeremy Hammmond's carefully documented . This is an accurate telling of the ugly founding of the state of Israel. Anyone who knows me or my work knows that approach issues in good faith and with care. I was once a supporter of Israel. I grew up in a home that was devoted to the state, but a dispassionate investigation of the history caused me to change my mind. The Palestinians are the victims--and one need not approve of their corrupt "leadership" to see this. I heartily recommend Hammond's work. There is much else that one can read after it, but it would make a fine start."We have come here and stolen their country. Why should they accept that?" --David Ben-Gurion, Israel's first prime minister. 30 Jan 2015 @ 07:03 by Kerman @54.215.16.95 : VYfQaHtUCe How about the Zionists who collaborated with the Nazis, like Shamir? The Zionists ageerd with the Nazis that liberalism was the enemy and that Jews would forever be aliens in Germany and elsewhere.You are good at offering the official lobby line, but it is full of misstatements and distortions. Your position comes down to: If the Palestinians would capitulate in grand theft and other rights violations that occurred and are continuing, there would be peace.Your position conflicts with individual property rights, freedom, and justice. The state you defend has violated rights in every way from the start. Then when the victims resist, you cry foul. It is shameful. "We have come here and stolen their country. Why should they accept that?" --Ben-Gurion."The slogan 'Jewish state* (or commonwealth) is equivalent, in effect, to a declaration of war by the Jews on the Arabs." --Judah Magnes, founder, chancellor, president, the Hebrew University, Jerusalem Readers: Check this all out for yourselves. Don't do history a priori. Other entries in Articles 1 May 2007 @ 20:51: 'Where The Nazi 'Big Lie' Endures 18 Jun 2004 @ 17:07: Ray Charles--Zionist 2 Dec 2003 @ 16:53: Jimmy Carter and Middle East Peace
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