New Civilization News: Graffiti Conundrum    
 Graffiti Conundrum29 comments
31 May 2005 @ 14:29, by Brian Outten

PLEASE HELP AND ADVISE!

I am dealing with youths who have a developed a passion for Graffiti artwork and need to offer useful advise to those concerned!
Basically, the conundrum is;

Does one encourage and try to harness the creativety for those who have a passion for Graffiti by allowing them to express their work on paper and or by way of painting on 'legal' walls, with the hope that 'that is where it will end!'

or

Does one actively discourage its practice in any shape or form thereby not showing any tolerance for it in light of its serious anti-social ramifications?

My deepest appreciation for any contributions or opinions on this one.

Brian


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29 comments

31 May 2005 @ 15:24 by judih : Frame it
what is graffiti but a loud desire to be heard? Does it ever help to squelch such desire? (rhetorical question) Suppression causes exacerbation. The political use of language is one of the surest rights allowed in democratic nations.

The energy needs to be focused. How about poetry slams? Or alternatively, graffiti slams.

Set up a day, place, audience and have big scrims of fabric/paper available for competitors.

Spray paint, judging, prizes.

Make it an exhibit.

(one idea)

Another idea. Photograph the graffiti and have an exhibit of previous creations.
Publicize it - put it on the net.

My idea is to 'frame' it. Make clear delineations. Statements need beginnings and endings - otherwise nobody listens.

Frame the need to express by creating a definite opportunity.

What do you think?

judih  



31 May 2005 @ 15:50 by jmarc : There is an element of danger
involved too. Tagging as it's called hereabouts can be a form of showing one's courage. So there should be an outlet for that too. As far as graffitti on places that it shouldn't be, the best way to combat that is to cover it immediately, as many times as necessary.Catching the perpetrators and making them do the covering of it is a good form of punishment. It definitely should not be rewarded, as it is destroying property. Judih's idea is good too, but the element of danger that the artist is seeking should also be adressed.  


1 Jun 2005 @ 11:47 by bri_outten : Appreciation, but not sure it would work
Thanks for your ideas judi, although I'm not sure whether it would work, in as much as it tends or leans towards a tacit 'approval' or encouragement of that form of expression. Poetry is fine, but as to its relative credentials as an art form, I do not believe 'word / name' tagging in its various forms has any real value or contributes to anything.
Apologies for having a 'narrow' view on this, but I have been struggling with the rights and wrongs of this for some time.
Cheers nevertheless.  



1 Jun 2005 @ 11:49 by bri_outten : Jmarc
Im more inclined to agree with you. I feel that painting over anything done out there is a must.
nevertheless the idea of the perpetrators showing courage is a real part of the psychology going on.
This needs to be understood and channelled alternatively in my opinion.
Thanks for your words  



1 Jun 2005 @ 17:25 by sammyjoe @68.160.9.93 : graffiti
help "artists" find the correct medium for thier energy. Hook them up with the community finding businesses or town offices that will allow or even desire the artistic expression on thier walls, (interior,exterior) canvas, furniture, etc.
Use the creativity, thereby serving the needs of the individual with the needs of the commnity. Therby fostering self-worth and appreciation, the value of supporting the community and giving to others.  



21 Aug 2005 @ 12:15 by Yvonne Price @82.43.35.145 : Graffiti
I think you should let your son express himself as long as it's legal  


21 Aug 2005 @ 16:05 by astrid : I absolutely
believe that Judi's suggestions about outlets for creativity are all very good and sound ideas!.... as long as someone pays attention to what Jmarc gentle words of caution point at, because THAT element will always show up -in what ever amount.... hopefully lesser instead of greater!
Sure, this all requires COMMUNIY effort and not only that, but genuine HEART- felt engagment, as in embracing the creativity; Businesses, town officies etc. just like sammyjoe (also) emphazises!
In the Medieval Times artists were held in high regard and were paid by the Community/ Town / the Top-guy in charge.
Also, Graffity Art can be fantastic and should be allowed to be encouraged on surfaces that are move'able, like canvas, so that they could have their own Facilities: am ongoing, ever changing,exhibition, where people could buy prints, posters of these Works!
Artists should be reachable for private ORDERS; Custom works! I know this has been done (in small scale, by some commuities. If I remember correct, someone did organize Youngsters' G-art in Harlem in this manner and the young artists were all of sudden so saught after by Private people ( maybe Art Collectors/ Art Speculators ) so the Kids barely had time for school anymore; so busy filling all the orders!... This Event I'm thinking of was shown and discussed several years ago on Oprah Talkshow, I believe)  



22 Aug 2005 @ 03:41 by vaxen : You...
aren't giving us much information, vis a vis "I am dealing with youths who...." on your situation.

What do you mean by ''dealing with?'' And have you thought about asking them (the kids) what you should do? Or is this another one of those "Oh we know what's best for you'' types of vigils?

You might think about sending them to bootcamp so they can go spray bullets in Iraq/Iran...I'm told that's a good thing for kids and a healthy outlet for 'teenage' emotions.

In any case I'm with the youth on this one. Attack the enemy any way you can. The enemy is? Yup, you guessed it! Go youth!  



24 Aug 2005 @ 20:28 by jerryvest : I suspect that many of these kids have
been pushed out of school or have dropped out. We have a community youth center near our home and the art director has displayed these 'art forms' in front of the school on very large back drops. I remember, early on, that we would get lots of graffitti and marking around our place. Now, never.

Anyway, I think that these kids are letting our community know that we have failed them--what else can they do? I know many who think that punishing these kids will prevent further displays. The Boot Camps promote abuse and insults--not a good way to demonstrate or teach respect and dignity. I suspect the bullies administering these programs are having a ball. Come on, let's practice what we teach and offer up some reasonable and creative alternatives as Judih suggests.  



25 Aug 2005 @ 06:32 by vaxen : Well, yeah...
teach them how to warchalk? In Atlanta especially in places like ''buttermilk bottom'' and the ''west side'' you can find really beautiful ''whole side of the building'' murals done by ''graffiti'' artists who graduated, thanks to certain ''programs'' into a whole 'nuther level' of response ability. Every city has old abandoned buildings. Every city has slums that are in dire need of repair. Certainly don't discourage these people from expressing themselves for that will only have the opposite effect. Maybe offer the city a ''project'' and get the ''city goverment'' types involved. Parks department? What else is being offered to these little rebels? How old are they? What are their dreams? Do they see themsleves in a positive light or where on earth are they from? I mean are they Ghetto kids or...

Maybe get some spare computers and get them involved in the net? Teach them how to hack...be creative but ask them. Find out who they are as people. Sounds interesting in any case.  



25 Aug 2005 @ 20:00 by astrid : the ART of Graffiti....
as far as coming up with truly innovative painting techniques go in many instances leave the old Masters far behind! and what is Art supposed to be?.... that's right; an expression of a person's CREATIVITY/innovativeness!.... dah! Is it maybe THAT, that many adults might have such difficulties with as far as "graffiti" goes: the CREATIVITY of someone who is young and full of life / creativity and has his/her whole life ahead of them... in other words:the good ol'jealousy thing.... It isn't always the result on the wall that the older generation should groan and moan about, but help the kids to express/channel their innovativeness in painting styles/techniques; the ART of the Art, to express their CREATIVITY; the choise of Motif's etc.

There's more (in Graffity) that leaves me speechless with awe than in most Old World Masters' Paintings:of which so much tends to be repetitions/copycats of eachothers works/styles!... VERY FEW vere truly genuinely inspired, while a big % of Graffiti seem to have sprung from someone's genuine inspiration!... most likely stirred by bottled up emotions from injustice, abandonment etc....( all from the grown ups!)  



7 Sep 2005 @ 05:46 by Raul "Frame" DTK Crew Los Angeles @24.205.48.70 : Graffiti or Art
Hey I was browsing the web when I came across this thread and after reading thought to add my 2 cents!

My name is Raul G. and I go by the street name of "Frame One" and I'm a "graffiti writer" and a "spraycan artist" out of Los Angeles, and I've been doing/creating graffiti since 1983. I bring up both titles of "Graffiti Writer and Spraycan artist" so that I may make the distinction between the two to help you understand what the youth you're dealing with really want to do.

Brian, if the youth you speak of like the visual (art) part of graffiti and not the action of (going to illegally create) graffiti then I would refer you to use the concept of helping the youth to create "Spraycan art murals". Spraycan art murals can be done 100% legal and I would not see why anyone would oppose such a mural on a wall that they have by permission to paint with spray paint. The youth can be as creative as they like!

You can by all means use the internet, books, magazines for many references and examples to view and show "graffiti pieces" and "spraycan art murals" to the youth in question. They might already know of several.

That should be more than enough to satisfy most youth, BUT if the youth are more excited to go out and illegally produce "graffiti pieces" and "tags" then you might have a problem.

ONLY one who goes out to paint ILLEGALLY can be called a "graffiti writer"!!! Someone who does ONLY legal art cannot be called a "graffiti writer". So for that...many youth go out tagging, bombing, piecing, and writing to earn the title of "graffiti writer". It brings a level of crediblity to the art in or out of the galleries. Making a name for one-self is important to the few who want that "fame" of being on top!

Because of the ILLEGAL painting I've done I've met many people from all walks of life. I've met the famous and not so famous, I've done work for movies, commercials, music videos, I've sold paintings as high as $7,000 per painting, my art work are a part of collections on both Coasts, I've done designs for clothing, business logos, music groups, ect.

I've traveled throught the United States to paint, and to speak about the subject of graffiti to students at high schools, colleges, Universities, and to many panels.

This year alone I've already done graffiti art for a new video game called "Marc Ecko's Getting Up" for Atari, featured in 2 gallery shows, participated in the Graffiti Block Party in NYC this past Aug. 24th, 2005 which the City of NY tried and failed to stop since a Federal Judge ruled in our favor. I'm currently preparing to go to Boston to create graffiti for a reality show for a major network, and I'm also working with creating graffiti for a facility realated to the NBA.

All that because I decided to do graffiti illegally in the begining and decided to purse ways to do it LEGALLY! I talk to young people all the time and ask them what they like about graffiti and what they dont like about it. I then focus on the things they like and see how I can steer them to get those things done legally.

I'm not sure IF this helped you Brian but I'm hoping maybe I let you in on what is possible for young people to do once they focus on it.

Nobody really likes graffiti, but I think everyone can like art!

Peace!
Raul Frame
raulg13@msn.com  



21 Mar 2006 @ 04:20 by Anonymous @71.243.141.87 : graffitti
Ok i wanna remain anonymous i am a graf artist and I know kids who like it too u gotta encourage em like when i first saw some graf i knew i wanted to do that and I had to get in shape to hit the best spotsand it was pretty good encouragment for me to exercise and eat righ and it don't matter if u graf cuz if its a blank wall and its not coverin vital info then theres no problem if u want themto keep it off the street then get Marc Eckos Getting Up contents under pressure  


17 Apr 2006 @ 03:56 by Istvan @68.105.165.74 : The best way to solve the problem
would be not to.
Haven't you noticed?
Everyone is doing it all over the net.
Ming provides the wall, your computer provides the paint/brush and you provide the what-not.
-let it be-  



6 May 2006 @ 19:20 by Monika @195.205.243.74 : grafffiti for me is a fantastic work.
I am not a graf artist but lots of my friends do this and i respect them 'cause for me is like showing your feeling by painting such wonderful things! I actually saw some legall walls for grafi artists and I was susprised of their work. I hope in there will be more competitions which will promote grafitti :)
Thanks  



29 Oct 2006 @ 19:59 by Dani @66.81.148.33 : Do they get paid?
I wonder if graffiti artist get paid to do the stuff they do  


26 Dec 2006 @ 00:16 by joe @80.3.64.9 : its a good thing 4 them
i can see the problem but it is something that excites them etc so u should encourage them....ok there is a illegal side to it but it is a bigger subject than that ,with all sorts of lessons and benefits for the youngster!they get to understand the rudiments of typography,calligraphy,graphic design,
character drawing,colour schemes etc etc
..i think when u present it to them u need to let them know that it does have an illegal side to it as well as a legal side (driving/parking has the same pifalls !)...u need to tell them that the authorities have gotten very tough on those who do this recently and the scope and opportunity to do it ilegally has declined...however the legal side (legal walls,use in pop videos/design) has increased.

u should be strict on the control of the spray cans that u may buy,get a well reknowned graffiti writer to demonstrate and also there is an excellent film calle 'style wars' (director henry chalfont) that u can show them  



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3 Apr 2009 @ 23:20 by Lyytz @66.245.216.76 : dont fight us
THIS POST IS POINTLESS

Graffiti is a desired to be known and remebered. For your first question... drawing on paper... wtf? we all know that as soon as we draw it you will go and throw it away (not heard, not remebered). If you make "legal" walls, then other people will paint over it, and still no one will see it unless they are apinting (not known or remebered).

Now, completely banning it is pointless, becuase if you try to make some action AGAINST it, then you will have a sudden burst of rebelios art (fights against your goa). Now, the above sentence may seem like im trying to tell you to promote it, well... as much as i would like that, it still wouldnt work, obviously because then more poeple would do it, with the fear of being busted eliminated.

Im, sorry mate, but your screwed... we cant be stopped.  



12 May 2009 @ 04:32 by b : You might wasnt to arrrange for some sit
for some sites in your area to be grafittied as art and put some color to something run down. City commissioners like free art.  


30 Jul 2009 @ 01:26 by Brian.P @173.56.91.52 : check it out
1st of all graff is the one of the crazyest addicitons out there next 2 Drugz sometimes ppl cant stand legal and rather break the law the best thin u can do is try too scary the hell out of him or channel it through keepin him occipied with otha things like sports or music but in any real situation DAD ur screwd
 



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