New Civilization News: AMERIKAN DEMOCRACY DEAD    
16 Sep 2007 @ 09:19, by Vaxen Var

This is as good a place as any to place this recent article that I picked up somewhere on the web.

You'll notice two sides in this march on Washington. Pro and anti (Such a GPM!). Great Hegelian dialectic being played out in the streets. Lots of arrests and, as one demonstrator said, "We wanted to show you that it isn't just a bunch of old 60's hippies that are against this war."

Democracy in this country is dead. Of course your pundits harangue the people on and on and on about this country being a Democracy...but it isn't and never was!

Democracy is one of the most febrile forms of Government in existence (In existence? Where?) and always, without exception, leads to the kind of tyranny you see that Amerika really stands for.

The Constitution of no authority (cf., Lysandor Spooner) guarantees us a Republican form a Government (Not to be confused with the party that goes by that name but doesn't know the meaning of res-publica).

A Constitutionally limited 'Republic!' Not an Oligarchy, not a Democracy and not a Dictatorship!

Ken Keysey looked forward to the 90's being a time of great turmoil and change that would make the 60's look tame in comparison. Didn't happen. Perhaps this is the beginning of the 'movement' which spells the death of this tyrannical faux 'Democracy' foisted upon the unwitting of this country by a colony of thieves, deceivers, liars, and jesters perporting to be worthy of leading us!

Enough is enough! Let the drums roll! Let the walls of Jericho fall by the blasts of this new years shofar and let the tyrants run out of their hiding places into the streets to face us! They won't. They'll send their shock troops, their Gestapos, their 'boodle-boys in blue' to strike down old men and women, young girls and boys.

But I assure you their end is near...

By MATTHEW BARAKAT, Associated Press Writer
50 minutes ago

WASHINGTON - Several thousand anti-war demonstrators marched through downtown Washington on Saturday, clashing with police at the foot of the Capitol steps where more than 190 protesters were arrested. ADVERTISEMENT

The group marched from the White House to the Capitol to demand an end to the Iraq war. Their numbers stretched for blocks along Pennsylvania Avenue, and they held banners and signs and chanted, "What do we want? Troops out. When do we want it? Now."

Army veteran Justin Cliburn, 25, of Lawton, Okla., was among a contingent of Iraq veterans in attendance.

"We're occupying a people who do not want us there," Cliburn said of Iraq. "We're here to show that it isn't just a bunch of old hippies from the 60s who are against this war."

Counterprotesters lined the sidewalks behind metal barricades. There were some heated shouting matches between the two sides.

The arrests came after protesters lay down on the Capitol lawn in what they called a "die in" — with signs on top of their bodies to represent soldiers killed in Iraq. When police took no action, some of the protesters started climbing over a barricade at the foot of the Capitol steps.

Many were arrested without a struggle after they jumped over the waist-high barrier. But some grew angry as police with shields and riot gear attempted to push them back. At least two people were showered with chemical spray. Protesters responded by throwing signs and chanting: "Shame on you."

The number of arrests by Capitol Police on Saturday was much higher than previous anti-war rallies in Washington this year. Five people were arrested at a protest outside the Pentagon in March when they walked onto a bridge that had been closed off to accommodate the demonstration, then refused to leave. And at a rally in January, about 50 demonstrators blocked a street near the Capitol, but they were dispersed without arrests.

The protesters gathered earlier Saturday near the White House in Lafayette Park with signs saying "End the war now" and calling for President Bush's impeachment. The rally was organized by the ANSWER Coalition and other groups.

Organizers estimated that nearly 100,000 people attended the rally and march. That number could not be confirmed; police did not give their own estimate. A permit for the march obtained in advance by the ANSWER Coalition had projected 10,000.

Anti-war activist Cindy Sheehan told the crowd is was time to be assertive.

"It's time to lay our bodies on the line and say we've had enough," she said. "It's time to shut this city down."

About 13 blocks away, nearly 1,000 counterprotesters gathered near the Washington Monument, frequently erupting in chants of "U-S-A" and waving American flags.

Retired Air Force Lt. Col. Robert "Buzz" Patterson, speaking from a stage to crowds clad in camouflage, American flag bandanas and Harley Davidson jackets, said he wanted to send three messages.

"Congress, quit playing games with our troops. Terrorists, we will find you and kill you," he said. "And to our troops, we're here for you, and we support you."

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17 Sep 2007 @ 10:03 by rayon : Quick read
of Replubic v Democracy and the only discussion available centres on every historical variance of both and how each is more closely related to either the Roman or Greek or not at all. Not a scientific clear cut differentation in any way whatsoever.

I therefore propose to advance the conversation or comments by saying that whether one has a replublic or democracy, ( the one difference is that replublics do not have a religious allegiance or monarch ), by saying that in a nutshell the difference depends wholly on the type of populace in need of governing. And in the Total and Absolute School of Vax Procedure based on repetition, I refer to my own thesis which can demonstrate the instrinsic difference of the Roman and Greek peoples. The former performed religious rites with the family and servants in the central courtyard gardens of their homes, with kneelers, as we know them now and niches for statuary etc, in their gardens (here the father/male elder was the master or ceremony or priest); the latter performed their religious devotions in the public realm, in full view of each other either at the Elysian Festival of Demeter, or at Olympia, or at Delphi or whatever, together with the full panoply of disciplines that were part of being purified, in BODY and MIND and SPIRIT. This is my own discovery, not read in any book, but found by own dint of research into buildings.

Now to turn full circle in this argument to the end of the story according to my thought. The Roman model of life relates to a publicaly protestant ethos where the power invested in government and the army is paramount to secure the realm. The Greek model is a nation praying together for their safety, and then afterwards making plans to build ships to defend against the Persians, or secure their trades routes.

Of course, along comes Marx studying the Greeks and totally removes the notion of group religious festival. The greek practice was not due to obligation, but because the belief was that there was no LIFE with FOOD and things, without giving thanks and making voluntary offerings of one's harvest which was deemed to be from the wealth of NATURE and an Almighty somewhere. Everything else in the Greek world stemmed from this, all notions of sacrifice for the good of others or family etc. Aristocracy bashing is old hat, everyone knows it, and does not form any part of sensible discussion. Aristocracy and a little inherited knowledge and wealth underpins and nurtures education and places to be educated.

The Roman model of Republic hardly needs any expansion as we all know daily what a powerful government together with invincible army does to world domination, but today there is the added excitement of media spin too. Thus Repubicanism, being allied to protestantism and its dependence on the rational, with hand on heart I cannot recommend to anyone.

But HEY, in the spirit of the Light of Jazzolog, who has also joined in the fray here I notice, I do advance the argument thus. It is strange is it not that the two main political parties in America, represent on the one hand the Roman Republican and the other the Grecian Democracy???? Just how closely could they actually reinvestigate the differences of these two, with regard to LAW in all areas, and try to apply them to their own PHILOSOPHIES and then seek to advance debate based on the profoundly accents and principles of each? While each in their origins were iniatially GENUINE attempts to grapple with the unique social environs of either Rome and Imperial Army rule and Greece and its the city state empire (itself is the v emblem of Athenian democracy replicating itself across the Med).

So let us (if I include myself here) rewrite the Replublican manifesto and the Democratic manfesto for governing and pass them over for consideration.

Signed, NSR.  

17 Sep 2007 @ 15:57 by a-d : Some Inspiration
for who want "Out" [ ]  

17 Sep 2007 @ 17:57 by vaxen : Nicola!
Thankyou very much! Do, let us rewrite these pie eyed old manifestos. Thesis, anti-thesis, with their overall synthesis in corporate fascism Mussolini style?

I thank you very much for pointing out the inane rhetoric found in most discussions of politics per se and bringing us back to fundaments.

Rome tried in all things to copy Greece but failed miserably. After all...they were Italians so what can one expect? ;)

All kidding aside the study of politics from the ground up, so to speak, is not new but is a refreshing new perspecitive here from which to take off in an entirely new direction.

Galactic Federation anyone? Federalism? Capitalism? Communism? Democratism? Republicanism? Fascism? Freedom? Liberty? Justice?

What a strange and weird mish mash of isms, all-pretenders to the throne of government. On a car a governor slows things down.

Is that the purpose for government, then? But I do think we must go beyond the quaint notion of town hall meetings as representative of Democracy, don't you?

I could, of course, get more specific as to the main differences between a Republican form and a Democratic form of government but...what for?

Fascism reigns supreme. I'm not at all sure that that is so bad.

After all it rebuilt Italy and Germany and America and Jolly Old England too. Collusion between the State, the Military, Business, and Religion (With a bit of ritual thrown in for good measure) is today known as outsourcing...

Not a bad idea at all. Order out of Chaos. Ordo Ab Chao.

I hope this will be just a beginning, an entre if you will, to opening the door for Nicola to step forth and lay some foundations for future mastery of the subject. Humanities relationships with human and other species. Polis means city. City State? And poli-tics is rooted in that concept so...

I favor the Pan Daemon. You?


The founders of the United States for America gave us a limited “Constitutional Republic” ("If you can keep it." ~ Ben) form of government NOT a DEMOCRACY.

“Hence it is that such democracies have ever been spectacles of turbulence and contention; have ever been found incompatible with personal security or the rights of property; and have in general been as short in their lives as they have been violent in their deaths.” Federalist #10

"...A republic, by which I mean a government in which the scheme of representation takes place, opens a different prospect, and promises the cure for which we are seeking. Let us examine the points in which it varies from pure democracy, and we shall comprehend both the nature of the cure and the efficacy which it must derive from the Union.

"The two great points of difference between a democracy and a republic are: first, the delegation of the government, in the latter, to a small number of citizens elected by the rest; secondly, the greater number of citizens, and greater sphere of country, over which the latter may be extended..."

See also the U.S. War Department comments here:

Prepared under the direction of the Chief of Staff.


This manual supersedes Manual of Citizenship Training The use of the publication "The Constitution of the United States," by Harry Atwood, is by permission and courtesy of the author.


A government of the masses. Authority derived through mass meeting or any other form of "direct" expression. Results in mobocracy. Attitude toward property is communistic--negating property rights. Attitude toward law is that the will of the majority shall regulate, whether is be based upon deliberation or governed by passion, prejudice, and impulse, without restraint or regard to consequences. Results in demogogism, license, agitation, discontent, anarchy


Authority is derived through the election by the people of public officials best fitted to represent them. Attitude toward law is the administration of justice in accord with fixed principles and established evidence, with a strict regard to consequences. A greater number of citizens and extent of territory may be brought within its compass. Avoids the dangerous extreme of either tyranny or mobocracy. Results in statesmanship, liberty, reason, justice, contentment, and progress. Is the "standard form" of government throughout the world. A republic is a form of government under a constitution which provides for the election of

(1) an executive and (2) a legislative body, who working together in a representative capacity, have all the power of appointment, all power of legislation, all power to raise revenue and appropriate expenditures, and are required to create (3) a judiciary to pass upon the justice and legality of their government acts and to recognize (4) certain inherent individual rights.

Take away any one or more of those four elements and you are drifting into autocracy. Add one or more to those four elements and you are drifting into democracy.

Atwood. Superior to all others.--Autocracy declares the divine right of kings; its authority can not be questioned; its powers are arbitrarily or unjustly administered. Democracy is the "direct" rule of the people and has been repeatedly tried without success. Our Constitutional fathers, familiar with the strength and weakness of both autocracy and democracy, with fixed principles definitely in mind, defined a representative republican form of government. They "made a very marked distinction between a republic and a democracy * * * and said repeatedly and emphatically that they had founded a republic."

"By order of the Secretary of War: C.P. Summerall, Major General, Chief of Staff. Official: Lutz Wahl, Major General, The Adjutant General...


Still not clear Nicola? ;) Right.

"If you make yourselves sheep, the wolves will eat you." -- Benjamin Franklin


An exerpt from A-d's link:

Welcome to Speaking Truth To Power—a website owned and managed by Carolyn Baker. Carolyn is an adjunct professor of history, a former psychotherapist, an author, and a student of mythology and ritual. This website offers up-to-the-moment alternative reporting of U.S. and international news, articles containing information and opinion, and a venue of support and connection for awake individuals who want not only to be informed, but to organize their lives and communities in ways that most effectively assist them in navigating what current events are manifesting.  

17 Sep 2007 @ 20:48 by a-d : ...That the Maniacks are
totally whacko and that they do what they do, we know....and we can't change them ; we can only keep an eye on their games and decide NOT to remain complicit with them by conformity and complaicancy, but assume the THE CHANGE!!! It is -after all-OUR Planet. The so called Establishment may be of their design and making but the Planet is ours -or is it???!!! Well, it is -to the extent we live in harmony with the the Planet/Nature. Who says we have to continue the/ir destruction-way-living/life-style???? whom are we really pleasing with it? Could it be our own habits, taught to us ... ah well...
Can we change habits if it benefits us more and if the new ways would be less destructive? THESE are the really important questions -as I see it!

here are some great sites that offer New Thinking in how make things non-destructively -or at least less invasively.

is the awfully sad article that sent me to look for better options -once again. (been working on this "plastic" -Thing for a while now and U have reduced considerably what I can accept to buy wrapped in Plastic.... until Hemp-Plastic is becoming the way of the day, so to speak.

The Idiots are in the (tens of )thousands (in each country. ) But WE are in the MILLIONS!.... Do WE not IMPACT the Earth at all???? Is it just the crooks -be they wrapped in this or that cloak; Dems, Reps, Muslims, Jews, Christians!....means NOTHING!!! a crook is a crook is a crook!... but WHAT are we? Co-crooks -with them in their games -or Co-creators with Nature/Mother Earth/Universe???  

17 Sep 2007 @ 21:04 by vaxen : Yes...
hemp! For sure. Six states have now legalised Industrial Hemp growing. Did I send you the stuff I have on that, A-d? I'm a member of the Hemp Growers Association so...

I'll send you the materials I have. Even if I already did send them...once upon a time.

;) Did a bit of editing. Hope you don't mind. It's the old 'ya gotta put a symbol between the urls such as * to make them clickable and some you even have to '{}' or '()'...

It's all good. My Targ ship awaits me and I'm off to that 'other' verse for awhile. Make hay. LUA-d

"Oh say can you see..."

"But what do I know of Paris except the Seine reflected in the shadows of the midnight sun?" ~ OSS-RA  

18 Sep 2007 @ 09:04 by rayon : Same Hymn sheet?
I wish - here try my spectacles with rosey views! we will always be stuck in the world of samsara (material-ism) until we see others as individuals and not always give them labels of isms all the time dear Vax. Talking only of the groups, and criticising the groups, these are non human entities but you give them the consideration due to a human being no less. This to me will ensure a sad time because nothing will measure up ever to these specifications. The views are not wrong, and many will agree, but it is not my approach from a purely practical stance. Any major investment of rhetoric should be towards construction standing up and staying up upon its own integrity. A few choice stones or bricks from older buildings reused in the right place, is fine as long as it stands.

You are right though, about the Town Hall - what is sorely needed in the UK anyway, is the French tradition of Helpful Community Minded Mayor who does make decisions based on the results, and is someone nearly everyone knows at least.  

18 Sep 2007 @ 19:07 by vaxen : But alas...
those days are over and the end of the old world is sorely fast upon us. So please keep a few of those old bricks around, as examples, so that those who do survive the coming all out madness might someday find those endearments enshrined in what once was the house that Nicola built.

It Is The Death Of History

Special investigation by Robert Fisk

In the aftermath of the 1991 Gulf War, armies of looters moved in on the desert cities of southern Iraq and at least 13 Iraqi museums were plundered. Today, almost every archaeological site in southern Iraq is under the control of looters.

And any 'ism' is, in my book, suspect of being more than just an ism. Let's toss it all into the fire and dance around like wild apes the night long and at the dawning of the new day who stands wins.

Here's what you need to know that NPR won't tell you.

1. Sheik Abu Risha wasn't a sheik.
2. He wasn't killed by Al Qaeda.
3. The new alliance with former insurgents in Anbar is as fake as the sheik - and a murderous deceit.

An Iraqi government official frets that giving guns and cover to the Anbar gang is like adopting a baby crocodile. "A crocodile is not a pet," he told Rick. It will soon grow to devour you. But what could the puppet do but complain about his strings?

This Iraqi got it right: the surge is a crock.

Greg Palast is the author of "Armed Madhouse: from Baghdad to New Orleans - Sordid Secrets and Strange Tales of a White House Gone Wild." See Palast's reports for BBC Television's Newsnight, now filmed by Rick Rowley and partners, at
Full articulo here:

Sen. Chris Dodd is attempting to rally grassroots support for his new Habeas Corpus Restoration Act.

I thank God that at this hour I am dangerous to the war profiteers of this country who rob the people on the one hand, and rob and debase the government on the other; and then with their pockets and wallets stuffed with the filthy, bloodstained profits of war, wrap the sacred folds of the Stars and Stripes about them and about their blatant hypocrisy to the world.

Kate Richards O'Hare's Address To the Court Proceedings on the Sentencing of Mrs. Kate
Richards O'Hare by Hon Martin J. Wade, 1 P. M., Friday, Dec 14, 1917.

Amerika coming apart at the seams seems somehow sadly fitting being the substrate of Empire and the pawn of the Princes of Madness...

Speak no evil, see no evil, hear no evil...

"A song of the rolling earth, and of words according,
Were you thinking that those were the words, those upright lines?
those curves, angles, dots?
No, those are not the words, the substantial words are in the ground
and sea,
They are in the air, they are in you."  

5 Oct 2007 @ 12:24 by rayon : famous Quoter here
on Lady Democracy - for you Vax: From churchill, told to me yesterday by someone else.

"Democracy is the worst form of Government, but it is better than all the others"

End of quote.  

6 Oct 2007 @ 21:27 by vaxen : Dear Nicola...
He was wrong! Dead wrong, about that. But thankyou. I knew that about "the gimp."

Mommie was a Brit working with the MoD - in the Pentagon - during WWII - of all places! Actually a Mancunian was she. ;) Sheesh!  

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