|New Civilization News: Sanity|
Category: Personal Development
37 comments7 May 2003 @ 14:53 by quidnovi : An excellent follow up on your previous
entry, Ming. And on your last comment: "universally known techniques for better unfact detection would be even better." The interesting thing is that you posted that just as I was searching the web to try and find a good link about Semantic General (which I did: http://www.generalsemantics.org/Articles/GS_defined.htm)
In so far as Scientology is concerned, I thought it showed some promises in the earlier days when it was still just called Dianetics, I cannot say that I care much for what it has become though. So I must say that I consider it rather a "plus" that you were kicked out (I feel more confortable around people who belong to no -ism)---as things stand, you most probably would have eventually left on your own anyway (just a guess ;-)
7 May 2003 @ 14:55 by jazzolog : Animal Behavior
This morning just before dawn I was walking along listening to the wild symphony of birds who honor our meadow, and I heard some treefrogs---probably mating---that have a kind of sustained one-note chant they do...but very intense. For some reason I thought of Tibetan monks chanting, and that thought led me to think how we as-yet unsettled humans sometimes seem to choose balance behavior from other creatures who already have it "figured" out. We don't have the one song of the blue-winged warbler for ourselves to announce our "place" in the creation. Maybe we just never will.
7 May 2003 @ 15:06 by quidnovi : Sentiency, Jazz
sentiency will do that to you---the opposite of no-mind, in a way :-)
A perpetual state of uncertainty is the curse of humanity, and its boon, too.
7 May 2003 @ 16:30 by spiritseek : Ah, but we all love a mystery...
you could say that uncertainty is quit a mystery in which we all live, I believe this is the magic that makes it all worth while. What I have gained the most in life is this one point...there is no certainty,so change it, you have choices until your dead (physical death), without choices there is no life.
7 May 2003 @ 18:27 by rmmiller @22.214.171.124 : YIKES
I pray for you all. Find a bookstore, get a bible, find the answers, don't burn!
Love and peace in the name Jesus Christ the son of God!
7 May 2003 @ 19:33 by catana : Good one
"Somebody who could think clearly and rationally, on multiple levels, taking all factors into consideration, no matter the circumstances. And, well, despite that Korzybski had outlined such principles in considerable detail, no such corps of rational people has been assembled in our world. Maybe because he outlined the principles, but not necessarily the techniques for getting people to live them."
Taking General Semantics as one model, you can say the same of all models that leave you free to find your own way rather than mapping it out for you. There's a list of techniques in GS, but no instructions on how to put them to use. I'm inclined to say that any exact map you accept from someone else is going to be the wrong one for you, personally. Most people don't want to hear that you have to work things out for yourself, and that even then, there's no end to the path. "Clear" is as elusive as enlightenment, and maybe just as illusory, in the sense that it's so easy to believe you've gotten there and have no work left to do.
There's no such thing as a frame of reference that will give us perfect understanding of another person, no absolute measure for sanity or anything else that is human. The best we can do is accept uncertainty as challenge and opportunity.
I guess by most standards, I haven't really "worked" on myself, but I've learned a lot by reading between the lines of what others try to say. That's where I find our commonality, and my personal meanings.
Of course, there's always the bible. :-)
7 May 2003 @ 20:00 by martha : thanks ming
I enjoyed your sanity post and appreciate your candor. My own experiences have taught me to take all of it lightly and not take oneself too seriously. Then the fun begins.
8 May 2003 @ 01:47 by b : Sanity is Certainty
Your right again Ming. One thing that LRH developed for Scientolgy was a gradient scale of awareness. After using Dianetic auditing to take charge off a persons moments of loss and emotion and deeper moments of pain and unconciousness one is able to go earlier to relieve the basic on a chain of like events. Then a person would be ready for Scientology, going through various grades of release up that gradient scale to Clear. In those days, the days you mention Ming, as the Scientology early days and what the current Scientologists call the Golden Age of Scientology was a basis of wins up those grades to the Scientology clearing course. Auditing that course solo took dedication and effort. Sessions, session reports, examiner, a case supervisor, all of the services of an advanced org so that one could go clear. That was discribed as a person who was at cause over mental matter, space, energy and time. So, by lining up that auditing, those grades, Those cognitive sessions with very good indicators, one can recall it in mind and so have it again. Nothing lost.
8 May 2003 @ 02:16 by waalstraat : The Best Insanity will Have to Do...
Since no set of thoughts or cognitions (no matter how large or extendeded they are)can depict reality and seeing without the lenses of culture or subcultures is darn near an impossibility, your last paragraph said it! If you take our society's operational definition of "sanity" which is the ability to reality test and stay within the borders of consensual reality (where, when, etc).
So we are left with the pragmatic test of perception, and cognition--how well did the behaviors which ensued from them produce truly constructive results that were life enhancing, as well as planet enhancing. That's the true test of how well we are approximating reality in each situation. Checking this out we may find a limited methodology, that is self broadening and extending.
In short there is healthy insanity and unhealthy insanity...it is well to keep this in mind when cutting through what one "thinks" is the unhealthy sort seems to be well nigh impossible...perhaps this was a channeling, it sounds wiser than Wisser...warm regard and blessing to you and everyone else Ming...from me Waalstraat (Wisser) in Netherlands...
8 May 2003 @ 07:39 by Jon Husband @126.96.36.199 : Shared Frame of Reference
Thanks for this, Flemming.
It's actually kinda amazing, given thae concentrated homogenization of input we are subjected to, from the marketing/media/political worlds. We share a frame of reference around "it's good to win, to be the best, to be American, etc" and about consumerism.
About how to view self and other humans in the world - we're sadly lacking. Thanks again for the comprehensive and clear-hearted "rant".
8 May 2003 @ 10:30 by quidnovi : Follow up on Waalstraat' s comment:
In others' words:
"Men have called me mad, but the question is not yet settled, whether madness is or is not the loftiest intelligence--whether much that is glorious--whether all that is profound--does not spring from disease of thought--from moods of mind exalted at the expense of the general intellect.
---Edgar Allen Poe, "Eleonora" (1841)
"When life itself seems lunatic, who knows where madness lies? Perhaps to be too practical is madness. To seek treasure where there is only trash. Too much sanity may be madness. And maddest of all, to see life as it is, and not as it should be."
---Miguel de Cervantes, "Don Quixote" (1604)
8 May 2003 @ 11:58 by martha : and according to the asylum
your new name is Crusty Chickenface.
Sincerely, Loopy Bubblenose
8 May 2003 @ 12:12 by quidnovi : Feed back on rmmiller's comment
30 Jesus replied "A man was going down from Jerusalem to Jericho, and fell into the hands of robbers, who stripped him, beat him, and went away, leaving him half dead.
31 Now by chance a priest was going down that road; and when he saw him, he passed by on the other side.
32 So likewise a Levite, when he came to the place and saw him, passed by on the other side.
33 But a [despised] Samaritan [YIKES??? Hmmm...] while traveling came near him; and when he saw him, he was moved with pity.
34 He went to him and bandaged his wounds, having poured oil and wine on them. Then he put him on his own animal, brought him to an inn, and took care of him.
35 The next day he took out two denarii, gave them to the innkeeper, and said, 'Take care of him; and when I come back, I will repay you whatever more you spend.'
36 Which of these three, do you think, was a neighbor to the man who fell into the hands of the robbers?"
8 May 2003 @ 12:20 by quidnovi : The Asylum?
Hmmm...I think I've heard about it, Martha. Isn't it what Ming was talking about?
"...half-lunatics walking around in [their] own little private worlds, seeing what [they] want to see, re-confirming [their] old beliefs, grumbling about things that didn't even happen, never quite understanding anybody else, other than when they accidentally happen to validate [their] own beliefs. "
8 May 2003 @ 13:22 by spectragon : Sanity is Over rated
The word genius comes from a Greek root that originally described the state of a soul that is inherently torn and conflicted. Certainly the greatest contributors to human culture span the range from eccentric to downright tortured souls. To shine brilliantly is often a painful process. Passion tends to be more compelling than reason because it is experience rather than logic that validates existence. Science depicts existence from a rational (mechanistic) perspective but that does not address the wild magical (vitalistic) underpinning from which the manifested world springs.
8 May 2003 @ 15:04 by spiritseek : Laymans terms...
Life is what you make it,you could see it as a mystery unfolding or a boring existence.Perhaps the insane would take the latter view.
11 May 2003 @ 11:17 by jmarc : is that what the asylum is?
An insanity sink for NCN? If so, then i confess, i am sunk.
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